Cleardebt, the joke its becoming

[stevef100]

Whats happening with Cleardebt lately?
Seems they are getting into everything to squeeze money of their client base, under the premise of trying to "save you money".

PPI - DRSP, tried using another PPI, told best use ours and at 33% fee, you can understand why they do, they will of course argue that they are not affiliated, but doesn’t take a genius to work out by their address and directors they are.

Now linking with Money Mayday Ltd, trying to get you to switch utility providers via them, so wanting bills sent every yearly review.
Seems they are not content on raking in their IVA`s fees, getting their kickers from PPI now wanting kickers via your bills!!
(also a quick check of Money Mayday Ltd has directors (former and current) with the surname Mond and their address looks awfully familiar. Amazing coincidence maybe?

Everyone on this forum should know that switching this way WILL generates kickers for all the associated companies.
Your IVA company should not be controlling who you use for broadband, TV, mobile or Energy, its laughable and a disgrace.

My advice is switch yourself, don’t be pressed into using theses *cough* `affiliated` companies, people are more than capable of finding their own deals
Also, if you are concerned about your personal data/details, request that your info is never passed onto these 3rd parties. It’s your right.

It`s about time IVA companies fell into the control of FCA. Can you imagine if a bank asked for your energy bills every year “to get you a better deal”. FCA would stamp all over them.

Cleardebt: Its time folks started looking elsewhere

[kallis3]

Hi and welcome,

I know David Mond monitors this forum so hopefully he can come on and comment.

I know my IP tried to get us to use the companies they recommended but did not push it when I didn't bother.

[FormerlyST1100]

Mmmm, I know Stepchange gets some stick at times because they maybe partially funded by the banks themselves BUT I am pleased I went with them and not one or two that seem to be cropping up more and more frequent with their "connected" companies.

Stepchange have never questioned who are my Utility providers, have never asked me to try and claim PPI through one of "their" companies and, as long as proof could be provided, accepted higher than usual fuel costs and car repair bills.

My last payment will be made to them on Monday (Stepchange have already confirmed this a few weeks ago) and will then just wait to see how long it will be for my CC to arrive.

It really worries me, when I see IVA companies requesting people to do things, like PPI, with companies that have the same address and/ or the same or related directors.

[stevef100]

ST1100, Sadly, Cleardebts owner will come on here and defend his actions as "helping out people in need", but nobody should fall for such BS, they are helping out themselfs, the whole comparison market is being scrutinised by the regulators anyway, as you dont get the best deal for you, you get the best deal for them.
Doubt Money Mayday Ltd are any different.


Also, Congrats on being 1 payment away from completion.

[Foggy]

ST1100 -- yes, Stepchange do handle IVA's reasonably well -- however, if there is anything slightly out of the norm they pass applicants on to Grant Thornton, who might not be quite so accommodating.

Of the "charitable" firms, though, they would be my choice --- however, if you hit a real sticky patch you will never get to sort it out with your IP.

I agree things do need to be tightened up with the variances and interpretation differences currently doing the rounds.

At the end of the day though the bottom line is business is business and all of these firms, including the charities want to make money. I know it is irksome, but we are better served channeling out energies into getting through this blip in life and looking to the future.

[luna]

Got to agree with positive comments about Stepchange, we've had no problems at all with them.

[David Mond]

Dear stevef100,

You negative comments really are baffling to me.

I do not see how you can possibly perceive it to be a bad thing for a company to offer a service, free of charge, which offers those who are in financial difficulty and on a tight budget the opportunity to save money. Yes my youngest son owns such company - so what? They offer an excellent opportunity for impecunious debtors to save money- what is wrong in that?

As supervisor of an IVA, I do not receive any “kickers”, as you put it and cannot claim any form of referral fee.

I receive a percentage of all of the realisations paid into a debtor’s IVA pot, in the same way that all IP’s are remunerated for the work that they do on behalf of both the debtor and the creditor to administer their arrangement.

If a saving can be made, this would not lead to the debtor having to make any increased contributions until the time of their next annual review and that would only be if there had not been other changes to their income and expenditure that this could be set-off against and even if those savings did lead to an increased disposable income, the debtor would only have to increase their contributions by 50% of any such savings.

To give you a numerical example, if a debtor switched suppliers 1 month after their annual review, saving £10 per month, for the next 11 months they would be able to keep that extra £10 themselves. If, at the next annual review, it turned out that they were still £10 a month better off, they would need to increase their contributions by £5 per month, from which I would be entitled to take 15% (75p per month), and the debtor would still be £5 per month better off. That means that, in the 23 months from switching providers, of the total £230 saved (23 months x £10), £170 would go the debtor for themselves to keep, £51 would go into the IVA pot for creditors and the remaining £9 would go to me (even if they switched providers themselves or through a third party). Clearly the benefit to me pales into insignificance when compared to the upside to both the debtor and the creditors.

If a debtor does not wish to take advantage of the free service, clearly this is of little financial consequence to me. If you would rather pay more for your utility bills and forego the saving you may have made, that is your prerogative.

With regard to DRSP, they are a completely separate company with whom I have no affiliation whatsoever. Yes, they operate from a multi tennanted office block where ClearDebt has it offices and I have explained previously on other posts on this forum that they were selected to pursue claims for mis-sold PPI on my behalf as they have a proven track record of handling claims on behalf of those subject to insolvency proceedings as their directors have previous experience of the debt industry. As supervisor, I need to be sure that all potential claims have been successfully and thoroughly investigated and I have every confidence in DRSP’s ability to do so.

Because I have such confidence in DRSP’s ability to thoroughly investigate any potential claims to maximise the return for creditors, I allow debtors to be awarded the first £500 of any successful claims which are received into the IVA pot once all claims have been concluded, so I cannot see how you could possibly perceive this to be detrimental to a debtor.

I believe your comments to be disingenerous but If there is an underlying issue with your own case that you wish to discuss, please feel free to contact me directly (davidmond@cleardebt.co.uk) and I will be happy to look into any concerns personally.

Sincerely

David Mond

[David Mond]

Sorry my email address is:

david.mond@cleardebt.co.uk

[lifenoteasy]

Impecunious - having little or no money usually habitually i.e. penniless with synonyms that include beggared, beggarly, broke, destitute, needful etc.

One of those words that is strictly correct but has grown to have a different connotation.

There is nothing wrong with what Cleardebt is doing so long as 1) it is clear that at the time of assessment that it is a voluntary process and that utility bills etc do not have to be provided and 2) the connection between companies is explicit to reduce any perceived conflict of interest e.g. we are a small family group of companies and would you mind if Money Mayday were given the opportunity to review your utility bills?

If utility bills are demanded as the IP sees that as a way of implementing the Insolvency Act then secondary usage should be strictly controlled and other legislation would apply.

PPI is misleading and up to a point is the only area that I have some sympathy for IVA companies so to just link this to Cleardebt is a little unfair.

With the downturn in the number of IVA's each year (over 30%) and the focus on PPI companies having to tighten up their act you are going to see some changes over the next few years.

I am glad I went into an IVA when I did but IP's are now part of an industry with profession coming second.

[stevef100]

David,

Thanks for responding.

Money Mayday Ltd, owned by your son, which also has you as a former director.
I feel that should be made clear to your impecunious (as you so eloquently put it) clients. You don’t want to look like your favouring or supporting a company surely?
Your companies credibility has the chance of going right down the pan, considering that it must be out of the scope of a IVA supervisor to linked in this way.

The annual review also implies that this is NOT voluntary.
Line reads “It is most important that you enclose the relevant information, as requested below”
From the check boxes I have selected:

Your most recent gas and electricity bill
Car Insurance and Tax Details of your vehicles
Any Other insurance products you have, such as building, contents or life insurance
The Details of your TV/Broadband/Phone/Mobile Suppliers

So can you clear that up, do your clients need to supply these bills? and if they decline your offer a free service, they are not under any breach?

My bank statements will clearly have those entries for the above, so for checking incoming and expenditure, along with payslips and P60`s, that should satisfy your requirements for the circulation of the annual report?
I, and I would guess that a majority of your client base, have the skills and ability to pick the best deal for themselves, as like a said previously I doubt Money Mayday Work for free and any fee`s they receive will no doubt be coming out the deal they are brokering.

Ultimately, touch wood my IVA has gone smoothly these last two years, it’s only the inclusion of the Money Mayday debacle that sprang me into writing this and I’ll continue to offer my thoughts for the benefits of anyone reading who are looking for, or currently in an IVA with Cleardebt.

Lastly, Yes I understand that DRSP, Money Mayday and Cleardebt, all share the same multi-tenanted office space, I wonder if they share the same technical equipment, database etc….as that would open up a whole host of Data Protection issues.

Regards

SteveF100

[Adam Davies]

Hi

Interesting thread, I seem to remember a well known IP setting up their own claims company to deal with PPI claims from their own IVA book so this is not a first

I think the squeeze on IP fees over the last few years has prompted IVA companies to maximise revenues from all avenues

Regards

[Dave Bowman]

So Clear Debt offering an additional free service, trying to save their customers money causes SteveF100 a considerable amount of outrage?

This is a joke right?

Surely the list of documents requested for the annual review is only mandatory for the review and not quotes on your gas & electric etc...
However, if they have the statements there, why not use them to see if the can shave a few quid of your bills?
If it's no obligation, who cares?

[lifenoteasy]

Its called secondary usage that may not be compatible with the primary purpose or legal basis for which the data was originally obtained for and it is not clear whether this is voluntary or mandatory.

What next - using the data that has been harvested to decide that Stepchange guidance is too lenient and deciding that based on local information held that allowances for clients need to be configured to reflect that?

I'm not suggesting that is the case but it seems that staff working for IVA companies seem a little blase around using the information they are obtaining.

Just as well that the IP who was fined by their professional association for a data breach was only dealt with there - it would have been 20 times more expensive if it had got to the ICO.

[Foggy]

As long as everything is transparent, voluntary and within the DP regulations, I see no harm. Many companies have various offshoots dealing with differing aspects.

I am afraid that, in today's climate, where the "big boys" are muscling in to corner the market ( in some cases aided and abetted by the creditors themselves ) the smaller firms have to take advantage of other income streams.

[stevef100]

Dave Bowman,

You really believe its "free"?
Money Mayday needs paid somehow and its via the supplier you will be switching too, so that fee is coming out of your deal.
Only you can really get yourself the cheapest deal.

Also, David Mond has not answered whether or not this is voluntary or mandatory.

If its mandatory and its via a company linked to the IVA Supervisor, then we have a big fat conflict of interests.
This Something which only the regulator can resolve

Also, Lifesnoteasy, everything you say re:second usage is bang on.
ICO are hot on these matters at the moment: This is direct from their website

"If you have a concern about accessing or re-using information – whether it's information about you or information you've asked for from a public body – we may be able to help you do something about it."

I think David Mond just needs to clear this up as soon as poss

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