Now discover after my IVA with PayPlan is over that shared bank account was not fully covered.

[TonyF]

Last year I completed an IVA. Recently my wife received a letter from our old bank to say they were passing her file to their solicitors to recover the debt.

This is the first we had heard from them since the start of the IVA. After an exchange of information, I now accept they are entitled to come after my wife for debt payment.

The solicitor is now giving is 14 days to comply with their instructions to complete an I&E form and commit to paying off this debt – which is now around double what it was at the outset of the IVA.

Whilst I accept some culpability in not being informed enough about the possibility that our shared bank account was not fully covered by my IVA, is there not some obligation on them to have communicated with my wife earlier, providing an annual statement, and offering a proposal at the outset whilst the debt was still manageable?

I feel they have not acted correctly. Had they informed us of this 7 years ago, we would have sought to include some portion of that overdraft debt within the DMP my wife was running to cover her credit cards throughout my IVA. We could then have kept the debt within reason, could have arrived at some form of agreement. Instead they waited until my IVA was over and simply presented my wife/us with double the original debt and a 14 day action letter from their solicitors.

We would certainly agree to pay the original debt minus my IVA payments to them, and would even consider taking on the whole of that original debt. But it feels repugnant to me that we are being instructed to pay twice as much having not been given the opportunity to settle this in another way all those years ago.

I will be contacting my IVA company, PayPlan, but I am at the point where I feel I need advice from alternative sources as to how to proceed from here.


Thank you.

[Adam Davies]

Hi

I do understand your concerns and frustration however your wife will have to come to an arrangement and repay the debt

The only area that you can look at is the amount owed, any dividend received from your IVA should come off the total debt

Regards

[TonyF]

Andy

Thank you for the response. So you are saying that they had every right to continue adding interest to this debt without informing my wife, thereby denying her the opportunity to settle this whilst the debt was half as low as it is now? Are they not obliged to even issue annual statements so that she was informed?

Regards.

Tony

[lifenoteasy]

They probably should have done more and you probably have room to complain that could lead to a lower amount being asked for.

[Adam Davies]

Hi

I think they are obliged to send an annual statement, could be an area to investigate.

How much are they claiming ? are you in a position to offer a short settlement ?

Regards

Regards

[TonyF]

Andy

The debt going into the IVA 7 years ago was around £6,500, and they are now claiming in excess of £13,000. They have provided us with no evidence that the IVA dividend has been accounted for. In short - they are asking for this without any explanation as to how it was arrived at.

Currently the most we could offer them would be £3,000.

Thank you for your reply.

Tony

[longslog101]

There is something called statute barred.

it would seem from all I have read the key thing is NOT to acknowledge or agree the debt, in the first instance. if you do the statue barred clock is reset (layperson view).

Read here https://www.citizensadvice.org.uk/debt- ... te-a-debt/

search the page for statute....

font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica">quote:<hr height="1" noshade>In law, a lender has a set amount of time to take you to court for a debt. If a lender doesn’t start court action within the time limit, they usually can't force you to pay back the money. The debt is then known as statute barred.

If it's been around six years (five years in Scotland)or more since you've paid any money towards the debt or written to the lender about it, it's important to check what to do next before you contact the lender. This is because if you say the wrong thing, it may affect your right to argue that you don't owe the money.

You should check whether a debt is statute barred in the following situations:
•before you contact a lender to arrange repayment of a debt
•if you're taken to court for money you owe.

If the lender does get in touch with you after six years (five years in Scotland), you should not agree that you owe any money or offer to make payments until you've taken advice from a specialist debt adviser. This will help you to avoid accidently admitting you owe the money when you don't. Once you admit you owe the money, the time limit may no longer apply.

If you think it's been six years (five years in Scotland) or more since you paid any money towards your debt, you should get advice about what to do before you have any contact with the lender. You can get advice from your local Citizens Advice Bureau. To search for details of your nearest CAB, including those that can give advice by email, click on nearest CAB.

here are a few more links
http://www.bailiffhelpforum.co.uk/viewt ... =69&t=2376

a few googles on statue barred is helpful and also the consumeraction forums are very useful, I have used those historically too, some very helpful people on there

[TonyF]

Thanks for the statute barred item. I think this may not count in our case because I was paying this debt within my IVA, but I will be asking about this before I do any more. My only contact so far with both the bank and the solicitor is to explain why I believed the original debt had been addressed in my IVA. In our case, it's the same debt, but a shared account, so they're coming after the other parson in that shared account.

[longslog101]

font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica">quote:<hr height="1" noshade>

Thanks for the statute barred item. I think this may not count in our case because I was paying this debt within my IVA, but I will be asking about this before I do any more. My only contact so far with both the bank and the solicitor is to explain why I believed the original debt had been addressed in my IVA. In our case, it's the same debt, but a shared account, so they're coming after the other parson in that shared account.

I politely disagree. They are not pursuing you for the debt because they can't as it was part of the IVA - you have fulfilled your obligations towards that debt and just your wife's name is liable now.

They are now instead pursuing the other linked person,your wife who was not part of the IVA, as the name suggested "individual voluntary arrangement" as such they should have continued trying to pursue her over the last 7 years.

If they have not then I would suggest there is a very strong case for the debt being statute limited with regards to her liability.

So, she is protected by Statute barred and you are protected by IVA, solicitor firm can do one, I would politely suggest that "she" takes the steps in the link below and sends template letter.

The consumer action group forums have several examples of solitors who do this regularly as a fishing expedition in the hope someone will admit liability, thus breaking the 6 year cycle, even juts paying £1 towards it would break that defence, so don't be tempted if they said, just £1 a month becaue as soon as you admit liability or make just one payment statute barred defence is gone.


They may try to suggest you have admitted the debt in your conversations with them, but if your wife hasn't spoken to them and everything is addressed to her the she hasn't - she can simply say she hasn't had conversation with them about the debt and you were not aware of her specific financial situation.

if it is addressed to you, that is a breach of the creditor/IVA who is not allowed to write to you. If they suggest the communication to you about this debt and payments were via your IVA I would suggest that is horse S**t too because your IVA is individual and nothing to do with her and there has been no legal or formal attempt to communicate or attempt recovery from her.

Good luck, let us know what CAB say about "your wife's liability to the debt", as yours is obviously over due to IVA. I'm guessing the solitors will do nothing other than letters and threats, which IMHO can be ignored., your wife's statute barred template letter should push them away.

As proof they may show a statement with payments to it from the insolvency firm that shows payments within 6 years, clearly stating these were payments from you through IVA wills show these were not payments from her.

There is a guide here, I would use the template letter and get your wife to send it to the solicitor firm recorded delivery as suggested here http://moneyaware.co.uk/2013/10/statute-barred-debt/

If they have any brains they will realise there is no low hanging fruit here and stop, they may threaten court regardless in which case let them, a judge would laugh it out IMHO.

I'm no pro and a free half hour solicitor consultation of legal assistance which is part of many house hold insurance polices may be of use to you, I would also ask the question in the legal section of the consumer action group forums too, they are very quick and free.

[TonyF]

Longslog101: Thank you very much for that long and thoughtful reponse. I take your point and, I must confess, I did wonder whether it might be the case as you've suggested, but dismissed the idea as being too hopeful. Having read it as you've outlined, there is certainly no reason not to take that approach initially and see what becomes of it. The logic of what you say seems sound, and I will certainly investigate this snagle. I will update this thread to let you know, and once again thanks you for taking the time.

[TonyF]

Two more things: Should I change the wording in the template to acknowledge the IVA payments? Also, does this serve as a complain without including the word 'complaint'? I ask because I know that issuing a complaint stops the clock whilst it's being investigated.

Thanks.

[longslog101]

Hi Tony,

Honest answer is I don't know, just to make sure I would do nothing until you have been to see the CAB.

just to be sure you don't do something that could scupper another avenue.

out of interest what bank is it with, they definitely have bt sent you any arrears notices or paper or electronic statements ?

when does the account last show a credit by anyone ? any time within the last 6 years ? I presume you both signed the agreement for the account ? in order to try and enforce this they would have to present the agreement with both your signatures etc.

I would gather as much info as possible an have a look to see if your house insurance legal cover includes financial disputes and if so go see a solicitor for free, or failing that the CAB.

[TonyF]

Hi

It's Nat West. We have had no contact from them since the start of my IVA, which was March 2008. They have had some divident from my IVA, but there has been no contact - they didn't even send a statement to my wife to explain how they reached the current figure, or whether it even included those IVA payments. Thanks again for the advice.

[ginger323232]

The fact is the joint account was in your IVA - means that the debt was acknowledged - the 6 years re sets itself over again from the last acknowledment of debt, however the are exceptions to Statue barring (ie CCJ).
As indicated seek advice from the CAB the best way forward - however in the terms and conditions of bank account/joint loans there is a clear statement that both parties are responsible for joint debt.

It may be there need to be an arrangement with the bank to pay off the exsisting debt

https://www.nationaldebtline.org/EW/fac ... fault.aspx

[TonyF]

Ginger: was the last acknowledgement the last IVA payment, or when the IVA began though? Thanks for your comments.