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Timberwolf

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Post by Timberwolf » Sun Sep 21, 2014 8:42 am
Hello to all, new to posting here but I've lurked for advice over the years. Please excuse the mega-tale below but I wanted to lay out all the facts - feel free to skip to the last paragraph.

HISTORY

We started our IVA in April 2009 with DFD; we have a 79,000 mortgage and two secured loans totalling about 23,000 at very low interest rates.

Our payments were £607 apart from some reduced payments in the middle at DFD's discretion due to the protocol applying to our IVA.

The first hiccup over the years was when DFD wrote to us wanting to change the terms and conditions, and giving us the option of voting yes or no. We voted no, returned the slip as requested (had we not returned the slip they would have assumed a "no" anyway). Guess what? They changed them anyway, held a variation meeting and informed Kingston County Court that we had consented to the change. Have two emails from DFD dated April and June this year to confirm that we immediately informed them the change was against our wishes, as we had clearly voted "no" but have yet to have a single word back regarding them reverting us.

Equity release - I supplied two examples of mortgage rejections last year but in May this year were instructed to contact the Select Partnership to seek release of the equity in order that a full and final offer could be made. The identified equity had gone up slightly from about £3800 to £5501 but that was to be expected. Select came up with a secured loan to cover the existing secured loan, fees and the £5501 over ELEVEN YEARS at £464 per month on top of my mortgage payments. The financial advisor from Select said he would not recommend this solution and I declined to proceed. He advised (and I thought) that an extension of 12 months would then follow instead to recover the £5501.

We were advised by DFD over the phone when making our regular payment (since May but can't remember when) that in failing to proceed with the secured loan, a breach had been lodged. I explained that the financial advisor himself could not recommed the solution, and DFD stated that an extension would be the alternative whci I was happy with and still would be.

Made our last payment at the start of this month (hurrah - it's been more than five years of hell), and was advised that an extension would probably follow. Lovely lady at DFD congratulated us on reaching the end of the line. i sat back and waited for the postman to deliver us a lovely letter from DFD regarding a twelve-month extension and finally things started to brighten up after more than five years of unrelenting misery.

Last week we received a notice of breach for declining the secured loan in May; I contacted DFD and
they insisted that I re-engage with Select or I would be in breach for failing to make my best endeavours which I think I can understand. DFD advised that alternatively if we could source the £5501 from a friend or family member that would satisfy the terms of the equity release or if an extension was authorised, it would simply be a matter of £5501 divided by twelve payments i.e. £458 a month. I therefore requested that we go down the extension route, but re-engaged with the Select Partnership as instructed. Their figures are about the same as they were in May i.e. £464 a month for the next eleven years on a variable interest rate (initially 14%) and with a couple of thousand in fees etc to cover the £5501 and the two secured loans I already have. This means that I would be paying back about £30,000 for the sake £5501.

My wife is now at retirement age, is very ill (aspirating pneumonia, chronic cluster headaches and is on morphine and oxygen) and has remained working only to pay off the IVA; the doctor has advised her to severley restrict her working hours. She could maybe manage another year at most on reduced hours to cover the extension payments which would be £150 a month less than we've been paying. As of next month she will be in receipt of her pension which is only about half of her salary and she would need to continue working part-time to cover the extension. My salary will be cut by £180-£250 a month some time after October 2015 so I want it concluded by then, as we are really going to struggle for the next eleven years.

I have literally begged DFD over the last week to sanction the extension; bless them, the advisors obviously can't promise that and have said that any extension has to be authorised via a variation meeting with the creditors and could take six weeks to arrange. In the mean time we are to continue to engage with Select (possibly incurring several thousands of pounds in fees and costs) and to continue making monthly payments as that would reduce the balance of the £5501; I'm ok with this last bit although they haven't said how much....

IMPORTANT BIT

Since April I have repeatedly asked DFD to revert us back to our original terms and conditions on the phone, and like I said they have confirmed this request via email, but this has not been done. It has now become urgent as I have actually just managed to finally understand the original equity release clause and I can see why they might have wanted to change it.

The original clause stated inter alia that any equity release is to come via a remortage, and makes no mention whatsoever of secured loans. It states that any extension to the IVA is at the sole discretion of the supervisor, and makes no mention of a variation meeting other than to say that the supervisor's discretion overrides any requirement for a variation and that the extension is in lieu of of a remortgage.

I've swallowed my pride (not much left after being in an IVA for over five years, I can assure you!) and asked my brother in America and a friend over here if they could lend us the money. I am truly desperate, I haven't slept for three night, my wife is beside herself with worry that that we might be forced into taking on a further eleven years of payments that we could not afford to pay after October next year.

So, the purpose of all this is to ask these questions.

How do I, or even can I force DFD to change me back to my original terms and conditions?
Is there a legal difference between a mortgage and a secured loan and am I right in thinking that I cannot be compelled to take a secured loan if my IVA agreement specifically states that equity must be released via a mortgage only?
Does the decision regarding an extension lie with the supervisor, as is my understanding?
I seem to remember reading somewhere that any payments regarding equity release are limited to no more than 50% of my IVA contributions which would be £304, way below the £464 quoted. Is this true?
Finally, has anyone ever spoken directly to a DFD supervisor and would it make a difference if I did?


Thanks for bearing with me through this; I don't want to bash DFD I just want this nightmare to end.
 
 

Foggy

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Post by Foggy » Sun Sep 21, 2014 9:15 am
Hello and welcome.

First: The Variation. This is whooly wrong of DFD and contrary to Contract Law ( and IVA is, after all, a contract). A contract CANNOT be varied without the consent of all parties. This is a serious breach by DFD and, I suspect, you are not alone. You need to lodge a formal complaint with DFD and, failing a successful resolution, can then escalate this to their regulators.

Yes, there is a difference between a remortgage and a secured loan. A highly respected IP on here has had legal opinion on this matter -- the two are NOT interchangeable.

You can only be complelled to adhere to the terms of your agreement. DFD are using the modified terms, to which you did not agree, so the original terms should apply.

In many cases, according to the actual clause used in the proposal, an extension is automatic, following failure to remortgage, in cases where this isn't written into the arrangement the IP has to go to the creditors for approval. He only has discretion if the paperwork gives him discretion.

The limitations you quote are correct -- IF they are included in the clause used in your paperwork (either directly, or by reference to the particular terms and conditions these are included in).

It seems to be next to impossible to speak to the Supervisor (IP) at DFD, although this is your right and this, should you try and fail, should also be a matter for complaint.

Finally, I believe congratulations should go to Select for their integrity in advising against the secured loan route, which is clearly not in your best interests.
My opinions are merely that .. opinions based on experience. Always seek professional advice.
IVA Completed 23rd July 2013 .... C.C. 10th January 2014
 
 

fubab

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Post by fubab » Sun Sep 21, 2014 9:19 am
Hi timberwolf. I too have been a lurker for many years and found this forum an excellent place. It seems on other sites this isnt unusual. However read debtcamel. Your t and c's cant be changed without your agreement and it sounds that you have been duped. You need urgent legal advice and the best place to startis the CAB. Legal advice isnt cheep unfortunately which given our circumstances means that most will not challenge decisions made. You need also to make a formal complaint to the company and if that doesnt resolve this for you take it to their regulator. This type of behaviour is just not acceptable but you do need to be prepared to fight this. Hopefully someone who has had the same thing happen to them will be able to point you in the right direction and answer the other questions you have raised.
Youve got to go there to come back
 
 

Timberwolf

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Post by Timberwolf » Sun Sep 21, 2014 9:37 am
Thank you folks - I am sitting here crying like a baby at having shared this. The stress is causing me serious grief. Foggy, I am due to speak to DFD tomorrow to give them updated I&E figures, so will advise them that I am submitting a complaint. I don't want to do it, but I am desperate to get the extension confirmed before entertaining taking on any more debt.
 
 

Til

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Post by Til » Sun Sep 21, 2014 11:51 am
Dear Timberwolf

I'm so sorry to hear of your troubles but I feel that this is a mistake on DFD's part that should be escalated to higher than the normal staff answering the phone. Judith Anderton at DFD has always been brilliant with us and you can contact her through the forum on her forum email DFDForumSupport@fairpoint.co.uk

I would email Judith as I am sure that she and her team will be able to get to the bottom of this as Foggy says, they cannot change the terms of your IVA without your consent and a secured loan is not the same as a remortgage.

We refused the change of T&C's (but via email) for the same reasons.

I hope you get sorted as I am sure there has been a mistake somewhere x
"Hope is the feeling you have that the feeling you have isn't permanent." - Jean Kerr

IVA approved Aug 2008 - 6 year term - last payment made 6 Oct 2014. CC received 14 Nov 2014.
 
 

TzeKin

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Post by TzeKin » Sun Sep 21, 2014 1:48 pm
A great post...but lots of grey areas you have raised...I keep saying this whole iva business is in need of further regulation to stop inconsistences in IP behaviour and creditors taking the Mickey in the background.

If I was you I would seek a solicitor to get objective advise.Then you know what is real.

Or to cut the whole thing down to size borrow the money from family and jettison this mess and close the matter at hand.

No financial advisor and not wanting the FCA to red flag them would recommend that commulative loan.

So DFD seem not to care about that but to push the loan through anyway? Obtuse.

Speaking with Ip is not possible with DFD.Will make no difference at all.
Last edited by TzeKin on Sun Sep 21, 2014 2:45 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
 

Goosed

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Post by Goosed » Sun Sep 21, 2014 2:31 pm
Timberwolf,

When DFD sent out the forms requesting your agreement to change the terms of your IVA, you returned them stating 'NO' you were not agreeing to it,

Am I correct in reading from your post that DFD actually changed your terms and conditions anyhow, after you had not agreed to them doing so?

This is outrageous...how can they just do that?

DFD really do need investigating, surely they are guilty of malpractice here.
"When the seagulls follow the trawler, it is because they think sardines will be thrown into the sea".

Eric Cantona
 
 

fubab

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Post by fubab » Sun Sep 21, 2014 4:28 pm
Goosed, yes they are so really important that Timberwolf asks for a copy of the paperwork. If they have said there was agreement this is fraudulent and needs investigation pronto.
Youve got to go there to come back
 
 

Goosed

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Post by Goosed » Sun Sep 21, 2014 4:38 pm
There doesn`t seem to be a week goes by without a post on the forum regarding problems involving DFD.

What we see on here must only be the tip of the iceberg as those of us aware of this forum must be in a minority,

God only knows what DFD may have actually tried on and possibly got away with in the bigger picture.

Is there nothing that can be done about this company and the way, it seems, they operate?
Last edited by Goosed on Sun Sep 21, 2014 4:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
"When the seagulls follow the trawler, it is because they think sardines will be thrown into the sea".

Eric Cantona
 
 

Timberwolf

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Post by Timberwolf » Sun Sep 21, 2014 5:41 pm
Thanks Til - I've sent an email to the two people who have acknowledged my request to be reverted to the original T&Cs, plus Customer Support. I'll forward it as well to the lady you have mentioned.

I've just realised the 50% cap on payments must have been in the revised T&Cs. As the amount quoted exceeds my monthly payments by considerably more than 50% it would appear that even under the new T&Cs (which I have rejected since day one) it is not a viable option even if I wanted to go down that route. Am asking a friend later on today if he has £5000 lying around; I will never forget being put in this position by what I shall charitably, at this stage, call an error.
Last edited by Timberwolf on Sun Sep 21, 2014 5:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.
 
 

Timberwolf

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Post by Timberwolf » Sun Sep 21, 2014 10:44 pm
Stop press - some old friends have offered us the £5501, I can hardly see to type I'm so emotional! Callign DFD tomorrow!
 
 

luluj

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Post by luluj » Mon Sep 22, 2014 5:23 am
Fingers crossed for you ... And what lovely friends you have x
Sharing from experiences of dealing with debt

There is a solution for everyone .... Just need to stay positive !

Look at my blog "All I wanted was a baby"
 
 

Struzzo39

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Post by Struzzo39 » Mon Sep 22, 2014 6:56 am
Hope you get it sorted
Steven & Debbie
 
 

Til

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Post by Til » Mon Sep 22, 2014 4:32 pm
That's brill news Timberwolf! I would be in tears of joy too! Let us know how you get on and also if DFD ever get to the bottom of changing yo0ur T&C's without your agreement.
"Hope is the feeling you have that the feeling you have isn't permanent." - Jean Kerr

IVA approved Aug 2008 - 6 year term - last payment made 6 Oct 2014. CC received 14 Nov 2014.
 
 

Struzzo39

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Post by Struzzo39 » Fri Oct 10, 2014 4:38 am
Hope you get it sorted
Steven & Debbie
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