I am absolutely floored by the insertion into the variation proposal by my IP of the condition that he will fail the IVA and petition for my bankruptcy if the variation he has suggested - 12 months extra payments in lieu of equity - is rejected. It just looks like an ultimatum to me, leaving me no way out if they do reject it.
Maybe he has no choice brokebryn. What do the terms of your original IVA say with regard to failure provisions? The other alternative is for him to merely seek creditor agreement that the IVA be terminated, in which case you will be back to square one having to deal with creditors directly.
As an aside - as a debtor, you have to agree all of the proposed terms of variation.
There seems to be nothing in there about failure provisions. It just says that if the equity can't be raised, which it can't, then a further 12 additional payments will be offered in lieu thereof andthat the IP has to write to the creditors to ensure thatthey have no objections - all fair enough, no problem with that. But to be told that if the creditors vote against that variation then I will simply be made bankrupt without further ado has shocked me beyond measure. I cannot believe that this is happening after keeping faithfully to the arrangment with no trouble whatsover for almsot five years. I could have gone bankrupt 5 years ago!!
Last monthly payment made 3 June 2013 after 6 long years. CC issued 21 August 2013, but, er, lost in the post. Finally got it 17 September.
Why is this possible eventuality not pointed out at the start of the process. There was never a question that I could be discarded and treated like this if I fulfilled the IVA.
Last edited by brokebryn on Thu Feb 16, 2012 12:13 am, edited 1 time in total.
Last monthly payment made 3 June 2013 after 6 long years. CC issued 21 August 2013, but, er, lost in the post. Finally got it 17 September.
Why do people keep saying that no one will want the IVA to fail at this late stage - when the IP is dealing with me in this manner. I JUST DON'T GET IT!!!
Last monthly payment made 3 June 2013 after 6 long years. CC issued 21 August 2013, but, er, lost in the post. Finally got it 17 September.
Neither Paul nor I know the full facts of this case. Brokebryn needs to have an urgent chat with his IP to find out what is leading to this particular suggested term, and also to find out why he has not been consulted with regard to the terms of the proposed variation. The debtor must agree to all terms, or else the variation will be non-effective, but discussions with the IP must be held urgently so that both sides can understand each others concerns.
The decision is really one for your creditors Brokebryn - in my experience it is unlikely that any of them will want you to sell your property or see you made bankrupt, but you will have to demonstrate that all efforts have been made to comply with the terms of the arrangement and your IP needs to be helping you to achieve this.
I have been consulted in terms of having a letter with a proposed course of action sent to me which I duly agreed. I thought that the terminology they used - i.e. 'should the creditors reject the meeting' - yes, 'the meeting' - not 'the proposed variation' - was some kind of standard terminology for the most unlikeliest of cases that the creditors, one or any number of them, would actually reject the prospect of ' the meeting' itself - which seemed to me to be a riduculously remote prospect. Now they tell me that it means 'the variation'. I am with Payplan whose praises I was singing only a couple of days ago on here.
Last edited by brokebryn on Thu Feb 16, 2012 12:36 am, edited 1 time in total.
Last monthly payment made 3 June 2013 after 6 long years. CC issued 21 August 2013, but, er, lost in the post. Finally got it 17 September.
I have sent the documentation to Payplan confirming the outstanding mortgage together with letters from brokers/lenders saying that they will not give me a remortgage. What else can I do?? I do everything they ask of me. Thanks for your responses everyone. Does anyone know where if necessary this can be taken as a matter of grievance and complaint?
Last edited by brokebryn on Thu Feb 16, 2012 1:05 am, edited 1 time in total.
Last monthly payment made 3 June 2013 after 6 long years. CC issued 21 August 2013, but, er, lost in the post. Finally got it 17 September.
Mel, can I just ask for a little clarification please? What are the reasons behind my creditors not wishing me to sell my property or forcing me into bankruptcy?
Last edited by brokebryn on Thu Feb 16, 2012 1:05 am, edited 1 time in total.
Last monthly payment made 3 June 2013 after 6 long years. CC issued 21 August 2013, but, er, lost in the post. Finally got it 17 September.
The term "should creditors reject the meeting" does not make sense! Ask for this to be clarified and subsequently amended.
The reasons are that creditors are a sensible and commercial bunch - who regularly accept variations that I put forward none of which suggest that I make my clients bankrupt! Difficult to really comment further without having detailed knowledge of your case - but I think you need to insist on a discussion with your IP directly so that you can understand their strategy and the reasons for this from the horse's mouth.
When IPs are dealing with important issues such as the debtor's home - they must be prepared to take time to deal with these issues personally in my opinion. It must be very worrying for you right now - but of course they may have already been liasing with creditors and this strategy may well be creditor led - although of course you have a right to know exactly what is going on.
I'll be interested to follow this one and learn the ultimate outcome, so do keep us informed of your efforts to gain an audience with the IP handling your case. There is a representative from Payplan who posts on this forum, who I have met and is a really good guy, so hopefully he will pick up this thread and intervene if necessary.
I'm sorry to hear you're having a hard time! Have you spoken to your IP direct rather than a member if the team? Your IP will be better able to explain why the creditors have asked for this. x
Thank you all for your responses and advice. I'm going to bed to get no sleep.
If it is indeed, 'creditor-led', or if the creditors have indeed 'asked for it', then that can only mean that they have no intention of accepting any variation and wish to force me either to sell my house and give them the money or go bankrupt. That is precisely what I meant on another thread about being 'at the mercy of creditors'
I am frankly appalled that this has cropped up now. There has never been any mention or hint of any such procedure at any point over the past four years and eight months; there is no mention of anything like this course of action in my original Chairman's Report.
Who do I make a complaint to? I've no wish to speak to anyone from Payplan.
Last edited by brokebryn on Thu Feb 16, 2012 1:59 am, edited 1 time in total.
Last monthly payment made 3 June 2013 after 6 long years. CC issued 21 August 2013, but, er, lost in the post. Finally got it 17 September.
