Does this sound correct?

[nigel_]

hi

I have been advised that my iva has not been accepted as I only achieved 60%. The issue was with just one party who would not agree full stop, but theirs was the largest debt. What I cant understand is that this particular debt was a joint loan which i had no intention of defaulting on and was going to continue to pay throughout the iva period (its joint with my partner and linked to my mortgage acct)my partner was not included in the iva but apparently the joint pers loan still had to be shown. So i had an IVA refused by a creditor who would have actually received more than 100% of their debt (my standard monthly payment to them plus the contribution from the IVA).

Both moyself and the Money,Debt and Credit tried to discuss this with the lender but we both received deaf ears.

Does this sound correct?

I have now written to each of the creditors to try for an informal agreement.

[catullus]

I'd hazard a guess that this was Northern Rock but I'm prepared to be proved wrong.

What doesn't sound correct is going in to an IVA and intending to continue to pay one UNSECURED creditor in full at the expense of other unsecured creditors.

I highlight the term unsecured because it must be, otherwise the creditor wouldn't have a vote in the IVA.

It's a fundamental principal of IVA's that all creditors are treated equally and I cannot see how what you were proposing to do would be correct.

Did your IVA proposal comment on your intentions to continue to pay this creditor during the IVA?

[Adam Davies]

Hi
This raises an interesting point.
If a joint loan is included within an IVA and the partner who is not in the IVA continues to pay the full monthly repayment and lets say that the loan finishes at the same time as the IVA.Would the creditor still receive a dividend at the end of the IVA ?
Nigel
You could wait until the SIVAs come into force next year[hopefully] and try again then as the acceptance level is 50% and not 75%.
Regards

Andy Davie
IVA.co.uk Spokesperson

About me:
http://www.iva.co.uk/andy_davie_profile.asp

IVA Helpline: 0800 197 4838
http://www.iva.co.uk/iva_helpline.asp

[catullus]

The answer to that Andy is no.

Creditors have to "prove" for dividend purposes and in that situation the debt at the time of dividend would be zero. Of course it's all down to the timing of dividends as well but at the end of the day you don't pay more than you contractually owe.

In theory, the joint party to the loan would be owed half the amount they had paid off during the IVA by the person within the IVA, less any dividends that the joint creditor received within the IVA.

Don't ask if that person could claim in the IVA, it's a very difficult question!!!

I take it that you read Nigel's post that his partner, outside of an IVA, would continue the payments. I didn't read it this way but you're probably right.

[Adam Davies]

Hi
Yes I,m sure that this is what he meant.
Regards

Andy Davie
IVA.co.uk Spokesperson

About me:
http://www.iva.co.uk/andy_davie_profile.asp

IVA Helpline: 0800 197 4838
http://www.iva.co.uk/iva_helpline.asp

[nigel_]

You are correct it is Northern Rock and yes my partner was to contiuue the payment of the joint unsecured loan, this was refered to in discusions with NR but not detailed in the proposal.

I am awaiting feedback on the informal propsals at present, I havent researched SIVA's yet but will do so now.

Interestingly but not suprisingly the IVA company i used has now dropped me like a stone. What a nice caring bunch they turned out to be.

regards

Nige.

[MelanieGiles]

Having just read this post following my return from holiday, I find this matter rather odd! It is possible that adequate representation has not been made to this creditor, as I assume that your partner was going to continue to discharge the debt under normal contractual requirements as she is jointly liable, from her own disposable income, leaving you with your own income to make your IVA contributions.

In these circumstances, there is no real problem in leaving the debt outside of the IVA, so long as all creditors are aware of what is happening and agree to such treatment - but they of course do have the ability to vote in the proceedings. You would have to convince the creditor concerned that your partner is able to make the ongoing payments comfortably in her own right.

At the end of the day, the creditor wants their debt repaying, and your partner is jointly liable in any case - so what is the problem?

This creditor takes a lot of stick on this forum, and yes they do have a different view to voluntary arrangements from other creditors, but at the end of the day I personally still find them very commercial and able to discuss issues directly.

You may wish to consider seeking an opinion from an alternative insolvency practitioner with a view to representing this proposal, which may also be in the best interests of the 60% of creditors who supported your proposals.

Regards, Melanie Giles, Insolvency Practitioner for over 20 years.

For further details contact me at http://www.melaniegiles.com and view my IVA blog at: http://melaniegiles.blogs.iva.co.uk

[nigel_]

Thanks Melanie, thats encouraging. I will see where I get to with the informals and then look to another pratictioner, i assume ther are links to recomends on this site somewhere ?

regards
Nigel.

[aguise]

Hi Nigel there is a list of reviews on all the IPS and companies on iva.com also in my opinion Melanie might be a good start.

Ang

Please visit my blog at http://aguise.blogs.iva.co.uk/

[BlueShoes]

Try Melanie's own link; she talks a lot of sense and has a good reputation.
Blue