Grant Thornton problems

[Grizwald]

I've been in an IVA since 26/11/2007, had a variation in May 2010 to add on an additional year at a reduced rate.

On 16th January 2013 i received a copy of my annual report to creditors Under Supervisors comments it states: "In addition to funds held pre-variation of £5,028, the debtor agreed to contribute funds in the sum of £5,760 by way of monthly contributions of £180 for 32 months, this plan commencing in May 2010. The debtor has fully complied with this aspect of the arrangement and I can advise that the case will now be passed to my closures team. Following the final income and expenditure review, I can confirm no further funds are required"

I followed this up with a phone call to confirm that i need not pay anything further, whomever i spoke with confirmed i need not make any more payments. So my last payment was made on 28/12/12.

A couple of months back i was shocked to receive an annual income and expenditure review, i thought it a bit strange having to complete one of these if i had finished making payments, i filled it out anyway and attached a note with words to the effect of "What the hell? why do i need to fill in one of these? I thought i was finished?" and heard absolutely nothing, not a peep until 9/1/14 when i receive a copy of another "annual report to creditors" this time stating the following:

"In addition to funds held pre-variation of £5,028, the debtor agreed to contribute funds in the sum of £8,100 by way of monthly contributions of £180 for 45 months, this plan commencing in June 2010. To date i have received £6,120 from this source and can advise that payments are currently in arrears of £1,980. My support team will contact the debtor to discuss how they intend to address the arrears. I have also received funds in the sum of £263.05 by way of the proceeds from a VAT refund. The supervisor is currently in the process of requesting the required information to conduct an income and expenditure review. It is the supervisor's opinion that the arrangement has a reasonable prospect of implementation."

I phoned Grant Thornton on 22/1/14 and received a call back in the afternoon of 23/1/14. The woman i spoke to basically told me my case had been passed to the closures team by mistake, and would send me out an income and expenditure form and take matters from there, telling me that i am in fact in arrears.

The problem is, where do i go from here? After the letter on 16/1/13 and phoning them to confirm i was debt free and need not make any more payments i immediately stopped paying. My life has moved on since then, my outgoings have adjusted accordingly, i have a car to run now and owe my mum about £2,700 so i don't have £180 a month spare any more.

Should i pay another penny? Or is this their fault and are they liable? They have had 12 months to contact me since i stopped paying and received no correspondence at all, if i was running up arrears why wasn't it red flagged and contact made? I would have happily continued paying my £180 a month had this been brought to my attention sooner. I was led to believe it was no longer required.

[viperboyz]

Sheer professional incompetence the only problem been legal counsel cannot be afforded by people in an IVA and so GT continues to get away with it.
Personally i would tell them this arrears is down to them failing to do thier job competantly and should be withdrawn from thier fees and you should complain to thier authorising body.
http://www.bis.gov.uk/insolvency/insolv ... inst-an-ip
But i would like to hear our professional opinions on this forum can a big company get away with such incompetance and still get paid? nowhere else in the business world would this happen.

[MelanieGiles]

If you knew you had agreed to extend the IVA by a further year, why did you feel that your payments were to stop at the end of 2012?

[Foggy]

OK -- if I read this correctly, in November 2007 you started a 5 year IVA, scheduled to end November 2012 -- this was then extended by a further 12 months to become a 6 year IVA, so was re-scheduled to end November 2013.

So, yes, GT were in error by sending out the erroneous report and compounded this by way of confirming their error on the phone ( maybe overlooking the variation).

However, it is YOUR IVA, not theirs and, ultimately, your responsibility to ensure it runs correctly.

So, both sides seem to be at fault here. I would suggest that, as GT compounded this error, they should be as flexible as possible in helping to correct it. But, the creditors will most probably want to see at least some, if not all, of what amounts to the missing years payments as agreed in the variation.

[Grizwald]

font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica">quote:<hr height="1" noshade>Originally posted by MelanieGiles

If you knew you had agreed to extend the IVA by a further year, why did you feel that your payments were to stop at the end of 2012?

I'm an idiot, that's why i ended up in an IVA in the first place, because i'm useless with money and paperwork.

Grant Thornton seem to extract a massive fee, what are they paying themselves for exactly? What have they been doing since 12/2012 to deserve to withdraw any sort of fee in my case?

I've also found another income and expenditure review looking through what paperwork i can find, and this seems to indicate the Variation was £180 for 42 months.

So my annual reports to creditors...

9/1/2012 - £180 for 42 months
16/1/2013 - £180 for 32 months
9/1/2014 - £180 for 45 months

See what i'm dealing with? Do Grant Thornton even know how long my variation is for?

Which department do i ring to get hold of someone who can get things done, who can find out what my real terms are and can offer me a final balance? I'm fed up of talking to dogs bodies at GT who haven't got a clue.

My mum has offered to pay a final payment on my behalf if it is FINAL and grant thornton will go away afterwards and grant me closure. Who do i need to phone to get this done?

[Grizwald]

OK here's the history of my payments into my IVA, i started initially signing up to an IVA with MyVesta but i think they went bust and my IVA ended up with Grant Thornton.

Payed per calender month by this job

2/11/07 - Synergence Financi Runcorn - £256
4/12/07 - Synergence Financi Runcorn - £256
8/1/08 - Synergence Financi Runcorn - £251
1/2/08 - Standing Order - £251
1/3/08 - Standing Order - £251
1/4/08 - Standing Order - £251
1/5/08 - Myvesta.co.uk - £251
2/6/08 - Myvesta.co.uk - £251
1/7/08 - Myvesta.co.uk - £251
1/8/08 - Myvesta.co.uk - £251
26/9/08 - Grant Thornton - £251
3/12/08 - Grant Thornton - £251
30/12/08 - Grant Thornton - £251
28/1/09 - Grant Thornton - £251
2/3/09 - Direct Debit - £251
30/3/09 - Direct Debit - £251
28/4/09 - Direct Debit - £251
28/5/09 - Direct Debit - £251
30/6/09 - Direct Debit - £251
28/7/09 - Direct Debit - £251

20 payments totalling £5,030. Grant Thornton claim to have received only £5,028 pre-variation, but this is close enough.

Changed jobs August 2009, stopped paying because of lower wages, negotiated a variation to pay £180 per month.

I am payed every 4th Friday by this job, hence the odd dates.

9/2/10 - £180
19/6/10 - £180
28/7/10 - £180
13/8/10 - £180
11/9/2010 - £180
9/10/10 - £180
6/11/10 - £180
3/12/11 - £180
31/12/10 - £180
28/1/11 - £180
25/2/11 - £180
25/3/11 - £180
21/4/11 - £180
20/5/11 - £180
17/6/11 - £180
15/7/11 - £180
12/8/11 - £180
12/9/11 - £180
7/10/11 - £180
4/11/11 - £180
2/12/11 - £180
30/12/11 - £180
27/1/12 - £180
24/2/12 - £180
23/3/12 - £180
20/4/12 - £180
18/5/12 - £180
15/6/12 - £180
13/7/12 - £180
10/8/12 - £180
7/9/12 - £180
8/10/12 - £180
30/11/12 - £180
28/12/12 - £180

34 payments totalling £6,120 which Grant Thornton have claimed to have received £6,120

That's only 54 payments all together which i know is shy of 5 years, but the report to creditors on 16/1/13 specifying £180 for 32 months i have exceeded this by 2 payments. This is why i believe i was finished.

I'm guessing grant thornton will have a copy of the original variation form that i signed, any way i can get them to look at that and tell me how many months the variation was originally for?

[Foggy]

I would suggest, as you have, I assume, been unable to chat to your IP and are getting nowhere fast, that you instigate a formal complaint. GT's complaint process is not, as it should be, widely published and I will look it out and post below.

If that fails, then you need to go to their regulators, the IPA, using this link:

http://www.bis.gov.uk/insolvency/contac ... ts-Gateway

[Foggy]

Here is their internal complaints procedure:

1 If a client expresses unhappiness with the service provided by this firm, then in the first instance the concerns will be dealt with by the manager responsible for the area that gave rise to the complaint and you will receive a formal response in that regard within one month of the date of this letter. Should we require additional time to investigate the matter, you will of course be advised accordingly.

2 If the matter cannot be resolved by the relevant manager, you can then direct your complaint to my designated senior member of staff Mr Paul Madden at Grant Thornton, Waters Edge, Clarendon Dock, Belfast, BT1 3BH.

3 If you continue to be dissatisfied with my firm's response to your complaint, you can then write to Ms Fiona Beighton - the Head of Quality & Risk Management who deals with any complaints arising from the firm's recovery department - at Grant Thornton UK LLP, 30 Finsbury Square, London, EC2P 2YU.

In the unlikely event that my firm is unable to resolve your complaint you can then complain to my regulatory body – the Insolvency Practitioners Association.