Upfront Fees

[OPTIMIST12]

All of this just goes to prove what a brilliant - and TOTALLY - free service is provided by CCCS. They will prepare a likely I + E with you - they will send you free and detailed leaflets in plain English setting out the pros and cons of IVAs / BR / and DMPs. You can read these at your leisure and make your own decision. Obviously - at the end of the day each debtor is FULLY responsible for the decision THEY finally take re the best debt solution for their own case.

Despite this - some people still knock the CCCS. Unbelieveable really.

[Adam Davies]

Hi
For info Thomas Charles sponsor the IVA.co.uk helpline
Regards

[Cybus]

Just reading through thie topic alone, I can see that there does not appear to be a set fee for this information gathering. I am curious how the fee is determined?

Why was one charges as little as £500 (sueann) and another as much as £1,200 (indebtforever). Why is it not a fixed fee?

I would assume the information gathered is much the same in each instance? ....

I would still be interested in hearing an explanation for the basis of the fees charged in my post above.

[acsn]

CCCS might have a very good website and they do get someone to call and discuss things through. But they sure aren't free and they never mentioned a fee during the telphone call. It was only when I read the Chairman's report I realised they got £800 for refering me on to an IP.

I already knew an IVA was right for me as I didn't want to lose my home or my job and the I & E done by CCCS was way different to the one done by the IP. My monthly payments actually worked out £200 less a month than CCCS.

So apart from access to their website, a chat with a nice but not terribly focused lady and a litle booklet I would have done better to contact the IP direct. I could have had one last holiday with the £800.

But desperate times lead to desperation and hindsight can be a very critical friend.

I think the old saying you get nowt for nowt tends to apply to most things in life.

But I'm pleased I did what I did when I did it. Life is a struggle in an IVA and I'd be lying if I didn't say I sometimes miss spending money I don't really have or get a bit down about wishing my life away to get the whole thing finished. But I took the risks, messed up and take full reponsibility.

People think of 2012 as the year of the Olympics with me it's the end of my IVA and boy will I be celebrating. But probably not at the Olympics.

[sueann]

Ok TC have sent me their final decision NO REFUNDS in their own words
'it is an open-and-shut case of no refund'.

Interesting that they sponsor the helpline so individuals such as myself who do not have a clue about the debt advice industry call the above number and are not advised at that point that this isn't the norm to pay a fee and you can do it for free. In my book that is not impartial advice from the start.

Sorry to say TC I am disgusted with you and I feel I have been prayed upon due to my ignorance. If only I had known I could have gone straight to an IP or any of the other free services I would never have signed that darn paperwork. Oh well a 2 month wait now til I get rid of this nightmare and in TC's words 'if you hold off the bankruptcy for another few weeks you will certainly be able to afford to put it in place'

To sum it up.. If your IVA fails or you find out later YOURSELF that you are better of BR you lose all your money.

[TheMatrix]

I do agree with you, still at the time I went with TC I was in dire straights and had nowhere to go really.

Just think I could have been another 2 payments into my IVA had I gone straight to a IP, maybe TC should have took their fee out of the 60 payments instead of making it 62.

One other thing I don't believe Oliver told me about the upfront fee at the time, cannot be certain but I remember seeing 63 months? and not 62 for some strange reason on the proposal and thinking thats odd I thought it was 60. But I was under a lot of stress at the time trying to get out of the mess I was in and did not query it.

[OPTIMIST12]

Hi acsn -

CCCS are free for providing unrivalled advice on the various debt options. Unless things have changed - there is no pressure to stick with them for your IVA or whatever other option you decide.

In my day(!!!!) - they sent me a stack of well-written stuff covering everything I needed to know. I went for an IVA but NOT with the company CCCS referred me to (nothing against them - I just made a different choice). Total charge from CCCS- £Zero. Any upfront fees from the (large) IVA Company that I chose to go with?? - absolutely none. Just good down-to-earth advice with nothing hidden about the fees to be charged AFTER the IVA was accepted. They made those crystal clear AND sent me a letter to sign setting out the option of bankruptcy to be considered - and signed as understood by me - BEFORE I finally went down the IVA path. They really could not have been more open and upfront. Mis-selling??? - Ha!!! I dont think so.

Obviously - what the individual debtor decides to do after receiving gratis advice from CCCS - or anyone else - is entirely down to them. Thats where the whole misselling nonsense - in my view - falls apart. Clearly it is down to each and everyone of us to make sure that we are taking the best possible and most sensible option. Like anything in life - never blindly accept the first option plonked in front of you. Make your own decision based on the facts - think things through and realise that at the end of the day it is YOUR decision which path to go down.

Speaking for myself - CCCS set me on the right path. They made it clear that an IVA would be no cakewalk but were brilliant in opening my eyes to the various alternatives. I made my decision and if it fails I will blame noone but myself.

[kallis3]

Hi Optimist,

Whilst I agree that we all have a choice in what services we use to sort our debt out, I don't agree with everything on your post.

You appear to be totally clued up on the whole IVA/BR business. A lot of people aren't, they are scared, worried and probably don't have a clue what their options are.

They may come across a site like this and ring the number. By this time they will just be happy that someone is willing to throw them a lifeline and they will grab at it gratefully without realising that there are other people out there who could also help them. You were obviously a bit more savvy as you looked around to find the best deal.

I discovered this site after I had started my IVA process with Payplan. They were the only ones I went to and they explained everything very clearly, helped us every step of the way and didn't charge us a thing. If I had not been happy, I would have checked somewhere else.

I cannot say anything about CCCS as I have had no dealings with them, but obviously it is in their best interests to direct clients to firms that they use - no point sponsoring the helpline otherwise.

Yes, people should take charge of their debt problems and get the best possible advice, but they are scared and upset, they'll accept anything which they think will get them out of debt and stop the phone calls!

[OPTIMIST12]

Great post - kallis - if I may say so.

We are where we are and my real hope is that my posts at least help new arrivals to the site relise how vital it is to go through things carefully and consider every point of view. Many posts have shown how dangerous it can be to grab at the first option offered and the problems this can cause. My message would be to people just starting - however desperate you feel - take a few days to read all the information going (not least this brilliant site!!!)- think things through - and weigh up your options.

I knew nothing about IVAs / BR / DMPs at the start and did a load of digging around to learn. It was time well-spent.

Thanks again for your fair and well-argued post.

[Skippy]

I totally agree with you Kallis. When I first realised the mess I was in I was desperate and couldn't see any way out. I Googled debt problems and the number for TC was one of the first that I found. I didn't know it was possible to go straight to an IP - why should I? TC obviously weren't going to tell me that were they?

It's all very well to say that it's down to us to make the right decision, but how do we know what that is if all the options aren't laid out in front of us? And before anyone says read the literature, (when you've already been told you don't want to go bankrupt) sometimes it's nice to have things explained to you.

Please don't get me wrong, I'm not saying I was missold an IVA, I'm just trying to explain to Optimist that life isn't all black and white, we are human and part of that means we make mistakes.

[kallis3]

Hi Skippy,

That's exactly my point - most people have buried their head in the sand, they've never been in this position before, don't know what to do and will just grab at straws.

When we first realised we had problems 18 months ago, we tried to go down the IVA route having seen all the ads on TV. We rang DMC (Debt, Money, Credit). We had an advisor come round, discussed our finances, told us we were 93% certain of getting an IVA. A few days later we were told - no chance of an IVA. They put us in touch with Hamilton Locke who sorted out a DMP for us. This was fine, but we were paying them a fee so obviously not all our money was going towards our creditors.

We decided to change and went to Payplan as my stepson was using them for DMP and they don't charge for that. It was them that suggested the IVA and we haven't looked back.

Fortunately it has worked out ok for us. It is easy to see though, by reading the posts on here, that people have made mistakes and wish they had had better information. It's easy to believe the promises made in adverts etc.

Optimist - thank you for your kind words! I agree that people who come across this forum do need to see both sides of the story. I would like to think that they would all take the time to read the many posts of despair and happiness when things go right and that we could make just that little bit of difference in helping people to make the right decisions.

However a lot of them discover this forum once they have already gone down their chosen path. A lot of them just don't think of searching the internet, going to CAB or just generally doing research.

I do like to think that we can make a difference to peoples lives, and reading some of the posts I think we do, but there are still a lot out there who are confused, upset and worried who we can't reach.

[greeneyes34]

I too went via TC after following a link on this site. I consider myself fairly intelligent ([:)]) but it didn't occur to me that I could go direct to an IP, I assumed that you had to approach them via an intermediary. I'm not knocking the service I had from TC but it is annoying that the £600 I paid them over 2months could instead have gone into my contingency fund. However what's done is done and I am now trying to be positive and focus on my meeting which is in 3 weeks.

[Jan01]

Hi all
I have been in IVA for just over 3 years we started paying in the March although our IVA wasn't set up until November why it took so long I don't know and at the time I didn't know any better. I wrote and asked my IP which is Synergie the date when I will complete my IVA as I thought the money I had paid up front was lost and was give the date March 2010, so the money I paid between March and November was part of my IVA I was asked to pay less than my re payments were for my debts and my IVA will be finished that much sooner than if i had waited for the IVA to be passed.

I have also read some comments about Synergie but I have found them to be OK the only problem I had was at out last review when they counted my travel expenses as part of my income and said that we owed them £600, I phoned and wrote and got the problem sorted very quickly, the only thing I will say id they take about 2 months to review my annula review.

Janet

[Soulgrowth]

I think a big part of making choices at this stage is down to intuition ... if something doesn't 'feel' right then question it first.

Debbie

[jpj]

Im a bit confused here!!... Andy has stated that he personally would never recommend paying up front fees, yet the sites helpline is sponsored by a company that does just that!! (presumably the upfront fees are subsidising the helpline?)

The majority of posts on this topic regret/resent having paid up front fees!

I personally never paid up front fees and the service I got from the intermediary company (your clear) was excellent,with one assigned person handling my case.

Clients should have to be legally advised that whilst some companies will charge up front fees,others do not!