HSBC

[Shining]

I am sick with worry re my debts, I am on the road to proposing an IVA etc., but I can't stop worrying, we have around £50k debt but it's over 12 creditors but 35k of it to HSBC, this 75% voting thing is what's bothering me, would someone explain how the voting works (in simple terms please). If HSBC say no what happens, obviously it's rejected and then they have another vote and rejected again (all assuming HSBC do reject it) Are we forced to go bankrupt? I read and read and read and probably read too much about debt. However, much I read personally for me I don't want to go bankrupt. Would not even have a valid reason for telling you why not. Some days I feel positive to be on the road to a debt free life, days like today I feel useless. Probably because the dog just cost us £68 at the vets and got to go again on Monday. I think basically what I want to know instead of all this waffle is A: if an iva is rejected, do they force you to go bankrupt, B: how does the voting system work.

Many thanks in advance from someone feeling very sorry for herself today!

[emma_t]

Hi There
I am in the same position as you and proposing an iva at the moment.
I am not going to eplain about the voting as am not 100% sure how it works myself and don't want to tell you the wrong info.
HSBC are part of my debt also (only £3900 outof £46000) but they are calling ALL the time - luckily they have my fax number and I ignore the calls that come to my mobile. I rang them myself to update them of my current position and they tried to offer me a loan - condidering I told them I could not pay my current commitments and was seeking an iva this seems ridiculous to me...
I was told that they like to see a return of 40p in the £1 through an iva proposal and will reject if this is not met, I don't know how much you are going to offer but this is what I was told they find acceptable.
If your iva proposal fails for some reason, your ip must have confidence otherwise they would not waste time doing it for you, you are back to square one facing the options you had befoe you decided on an iva - DMP, bankrupcy, etc.
Talk to your ip and raise your concerns and they will give you some reasurance.
Hope all goes well for you - fingers crossed x

[Andrew Graveson]

Hi isthereanend -

The voting system is based on how much debt each creditor has.

For example if you owed £10000 each to 5 creditors then each of them would have 20% of the votes. You need 75% or more of the votes in your favour for the IVA to work so in this example you'd need 4 out of the 5 to vote in your favour.

In your case it seems that HSBC has around 70% of the votes, therefore you will need them to vote in your favour.

You are not forced into bankruptcy if the vote goes against you. You may consider it the best option, or depending on your circumstances and attitudes other solutions such as debt management may be appropriate.

Andrew Graveson
Independent Mortgage Broker & MD Bright Oak Debt Management
andrew@brightoak.co.uk
www.brightoak.co.uk

[poppy84]

me & my husband owed hsbc between us about £30k & other companies various amounts.Our proposal was for 40p in every £1 & infact Hsbc were the only company to vote!
I have to say i agrre with emma that i think Hsbc are always throwing credit at you!Inever applyed for a credit card & they just sent me one with a limit of 7k.
Just stay positive & like emma t says your ip wouldnt be putting all the work in if they didnt think it had a good chance of approval!
Good luck!

[louiseh]

Over 25% of my debt was with HSBC, I offered 48p in the £1 and they didn't vote. Had letters before meeting date from them acknowledging IVA application so they were aware of the IVA, no vote though.

[sonyse2t5]

Some Banks don't cast their votes almost as if they want to see how it goes down and be asked again to cast the deciding vote in a later meeting....if the 75% majority isn't reached. But most will vote, but the banks want to be unpredicable??

80% of IVA submitted are accepted. If it fails you can put a new one through - there are new IVAs call SIVs that are more 'acceptance friendly'. They will be in force next year....so there is aways another opportunity.

[lily]

Hi isthereanend

I really do understand your stress right now, HSBC are relentless in terms of phoning and bothering you, some of the staff are somewhat rude and insensitive to put it mildly. I wouldnt take this personally, they are just doing their job. (trying to stess a payment for as much and as often as they can). Dont give them the upper hand, I feel they are very irresponsible lenders, I havent made a full payment for more than a year, yet they offered me another loan!!!!

I made a complaint about the harrassment from them, one day they phoned me every 15 mins.

You are doing all you an right now, you have faced up to your debt and are trying to propose to pay back as much as possible you cant do anymore than that.

If HSBC want some of the money back, this is the only way they are going to get it, think positive, the IP working for you and them will do the best they can as they are going to be aware that HSBC vote is vital, you are going beyond the 40 per cent so its every chance of going through.

I can understand that you dont want to go BR, does anyone??? It really isnt as bad as it sounds, it will free you from this stress and fear if the crocs wont accept the proposal, its a tool to set you free.

Please dont woryy, there is an answer to every problem, it may not be the one we want but at the end of the day, you need the fat lady to sing, she may be clearing her throat to sing through your IVA.

Stay sane my dear, have hope.

lily

[aguise]

Hi there also some may not vote for whatever reason and if, using andrews example, only one out of the 5 vote yes, then the non voters will also be counted as yes, As in mine tsb had a lot of the vote but didnt and it went through. As the others have said your Ip would not have put it forward if they did not think it viable. It is quite confusing. Someone put me right if i am wrong there.
It is a rotten time the waiting but have faith and stay positive.

Ang

Please visit my blog at http://aguise.blogs.iva.co.uk/

[Adam Davies]

Hi Isthereanend

Hsbc will have the deciding vote and do support IVAs,but only if they vote on the day.
We have had IVAs accepted on this forum where only one minority creditor voted yes.
You need a 75% or greater yes vote by creditors debt value who vote on the day.So to put it simply if four creditors vote and the total of those four debts is 100k you will need creditors that hold at least 75k of your debts to vote yes.
Regards

Andy Davie
IVA.co.uk Spokesperson

About me:
http://www.iva.co.uk/andy_davie_profile.asp

IVA Helpline: 0800 197 4838
http://www.iva.co.uk/iva_helpline.asp

[Shining]

Thank you I'm feeling much more rational now! I have my dark moments and my family have just been around and for some reason they've lifted my spirits even though they do not know of our problems. This forum is my godsend, I read it everyday, don't always post but I'm reading in the background. My proposal isn't ready yet but it will be just in excess of 40p to the £ so hoping for a positive outcome. Many thanks x

[lily]

really glad youre feeling a little better, any time you need support through this tough time, shout, someone will always answer.

Take care (get some chocolate, its good for the soul)

lily

[aguise]

Lily your going to make us all fat. I bought dohnuts lol.

Ang x

Please visit my blog at http://aguise.blogs.iva.co.uk/

[cr15py]

I've just been told my IP that HSBC don't accept offers of less than 45p in the £, hence why I am proposing 48p in the £.

[wen]

What I don't understand is, if HSBC were to vote no because "they won't accept less than 45p in the £", if the alternative is bankruptcy and there are little or no assetts that are going to get them any money back, then what's the point of them saying no to less than 45p???

[sonyse2t5]

Creditors with the majority vote play a kamikazy game and if they think we the debtors think that they will accept anything more than BR then all of us will propose 30p to the pound or even 20p!

It is their way of commanding that 4xp demand and will not waiver even if one pence less will give them a better return than BR.