Advice regarding IVA versus bankruptcy

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luluj

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Post by luluj » Sat Apr 02, 2011 4:35 pm
Definately seek alternative advice - it appears Bankruptcy maybe a better option for you...it is not too late to do this and as others have said the www.iva.com provides links to other professionals that are well respected - good luck !
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The Major

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Post by The Major » Sat Apr 02, 2011 6:46 pm
Hi Catherine

The DLA element of your income is not taken as Income in an IPO however it counts as Income with regard to your outgoings along with other benefits, for example if your total income per month is £1000 which is earned £100 and benefits £900 and you have a 20% surplus ie £200 after living expenses your income payments order can be no more than your earned income ie £100, in this situation you would have a £100 surplus each month which is yours, of course if your income was soley benefits £1000 and you still had £800 outgoings with no earned income you would not receive an Income Payments Order, I have seen many times in bankruptcy where a family solely on benefits and DLA have surplus income each month in excess of £500 who pay nothing in an IPO whereas others working with no benefits will pay over £100 per month if it is spare income, I have no comment on that, just stating how it is, hope I have not confused you, I have used figures purely to explain the workings, so your Income Payments can be no more than earned Income, if you have a surplus, however if you speak with CCCS they will tell you how much you are likley to pay in an IPO which will be far less in your situation than an IVA, and also remember the IVA can fail the bankruptcy cannot.
 
 

kallis3

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Post by kallis3 » Sat Apr 02, 2011 8:31 pm
Just to clarify that if you have disposable income of over £20 per month in BR then all of it will go towards an IPA, how benefits slot in I don't know.
Sharing from experiences of dealing with debt
The greatness of a man is not in how much wealth he acquires, but in his integrity and his ability to affect those around him positively.
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The Major

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Post by The Major » Sat Apr 02, 2011 10:01 pm
Hi Catherine

You are possibly now confused having been told two different things,my post was just to give you information as I give to others however my postings are obviously not welcome on this forum as this is not the first time my posts have attempted to be discredited by Kallis, with a one liner, when I have taken the time to explain something which is correct. What I have said Catherine is right and I leave you with an extract from the technical manual which verifies the information I have given to you, Good Luck and signing out, The Major.

http://www.insolvency.gov.uk/freedomofi ... Orders.htm

If the bankrupt is in receipt of benefit and other income, and has surplus income above that required to meet his/her reasonable domestic needs, the official receiver should still consider the possibility of obtaining an income payments order. Any calculation to identify surplus income should include all available income, including state benefits, which includes child tax credit. The only exception to the inclusion of state benefits in an income payments calculation is where a bankrupt is in receipt of child benefit, which is not an income based benefit (unlike child tax credit).

It is the income from the sources other than the benefit(s) which is providing the payments under an IPO, so if the bankrupt is in receipt of benefits and has surplus income, an IPO contribution should only be sought to the extent of the non-benefit income.

An IPO should not be sought where the bankrupt’s only source of income is state benefit payments. It is unlikely that where a bankrupt’s income solely comprises state benefits any surplus will arise, the exception to this is where the bankrupt is in receipt of non-means tested benefits, such as Disability Living Allowance.

If a bankrupt who is solely in receipt of benefits has surplus income and has agreed to contribute on a voluntary basis, no enforcement action can be taken if the bankrupt fails to make agreed voluntary payments, and voluntary payments cannot be enforced via an IPO.
 
 

Foggy

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Post by Foggy » Sat Apr 02, 2011 10:11 pm
Hi Major. I don't think Kallis was dismissing your post. The advice from both of you is, technically, correct. DI over £20 will be expected to be paid over. The question here, which you have addressed, is that there is unlikely to be any "accountable" ( i.e. from earned income) DI.

Far from being unwelcome, I believe your posts are on the whole helpful and informative. Maybe it's the weather, but people seem to have a tendency to take offence a little easily today :0)
My opinions are merely that .. opinions based on experience. Always seek professional advice.
IVA Completed 23rd July 2013 .... C.C. 10th January 2014
 
 

kallis3

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Post by kallis3 » Sat Apr 02, 2011 10:16 pm
I wasn't dismissing anything as Foggy has said, just pointing out the new rules for BR with the lower DI limit. If you have more than £20 then you will pay an IPA on the whole amount. This may, or may not, encompass benefits.

One of the professionals will hopefully be along and I do stand to be corrected.
Sharing from experiences of dealing with debt
The greatness of a man is not in how much wealth he acquires, but in his integrity and his ability to affect those around him positively.
Bob Marley.
http://kallis3.blogs.iva.co.uk
 
 

miss prim

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Post by miss prim » Sat Apr 02, 2011 11:31 pm
Hi thanks for your reply, think we seriously need to reconsider our position and speak to cccs again before the 21st April, no one has explained to us about how DLA is affected in BR. When we flagged up our concerns about our surplus being made up out of benefits and our position if we were to no longer receive it we were told "none of us have a crystal ball to see into the future" this is what has made us really worried about committing to something that has the likelyhood to fail. Lookks like it would be really beneficial to find out how much we would possibly pay after BR with an IPO.
 
 

The Major

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Post by The Major » Sat Apr 02, 2011 11:48 pm
Kallis

After reading this thread again I thought I had got you wrong I never saw the (How benefits fit in I dont know) at the end of your answer then went I researched my history I realised you were able to change your wording after I had posted, which I thought was not allowed, which makes it a little unfair as the rest of us cannot do that, your post was not edited, did you then realise I was possibly correct so you changed what you said after my posting?







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Posted - 02 April 2011 : 20:31:27
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Just to clarify that if you have disposable income of over £20 per month in BR then all of it will go towards an IPA, how benefits slot in I don't know. (later version)

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36 month\s down 24 month\s to go.

United Kingdom
46636 Posts
Posted - 02 April 2011 : 20:31:27
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Just to clarify that if you have disposable income of over £20 per month in BR then all of it will go towards an IPA. (Earlier vertion)

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There is a difference between knowing the path and walking the path.

An IVA.co.uk Mentor is someone sharing from their experiences of dealing with debt

36 down, 24 to go.

Jan
xx
 
 

miss prim

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Post by miss prim » Sun Apr 03, 2011 12:13 am
Hi, its not that we save the allowance we use it for all associated care and medical cost because of his disability which changes from week to week and for the running (fuel) and the maintainance of the car but if OH couldnt work for say 2 weeks then we have to compensate for the loss of earnings as he only gets ssp. Sorry if it made it sound like we saved, i should be so lucky, not done that for a long time.
 
 

kallis3

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Post by kallis3 » Sun Apr 03, 2011 7:53 am
Sorry Catherine - didn't mean it to sound like that - meant to say that you don't use it for a car but save it for your expenses. Apologies for that.

The Major - it was never my intention to cause any offence and I really don't know how benefits slot in with BR. Anyone can edit their posts although they shouldn't once someone has posted as it can cause confusion and sometimes can make subsequent posts look silly. In this case it did neither.

If I have caused any offence then I sincerely apologise.
Sharing from experiences of dealing with debt
The greatness of a man is not in how much wealth he acquires, but in his integrity and his ability to affect those around him positively.
Bob Marley.
http://kallis3.blogs.iva.co.uk
 
 

Adam Davies

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Post by Adam Davies » Sun Apr 03, 2011 11:04 am
Hi
Can't really see the problem here.
Very grateful for The Major to give accurate information as I am also a little unsure how benefits are calculated in bankruptcy when setting an IPA/IPO.
Jan does a sterling job on this forum day in and day out and I would be stuck without her.
Interesting that The Major talks about IPO rather than IPA, would there be a difference in the calculations with either ?
Regards
Andam Davies
 
 

Foggy

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Post by Foggy » Sun Apr 03, 2011 11:19 am
Andy Davie wrote:

Hi
Can't really see the problem here.
Very grateful for The Major to give accurate information as I am also a little unsure how benefits are calculated in bankruptcy when setting an IPA/IPO.
Jan does a sterling job on this forum day in and day out and I would be stuck without her.
Interesting that The Major talks about IPO rather than IPA, would there be a difference in the calculations with either ?
Regards
Hear hear
My opinions are merely that .. opinions based on experience. Always seek professional advice.
IVA Completed 23rd July 2013 .... C.C. 10th January 2014
 
 

kallis3

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Post by kallis3 » Sun Apr 03, 2011 11:21 am
Thank you Foggy.
Sharing from experiences of dealing with debt
The greatness of a man is not in how much wealth he acquires, but in his integrity and his ability to affect those around him positively.
Bob Marley.
http://kallis3.blogs.iva.co.uk
 
 

The Major

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Post by The Major » Sun Apr 03, 2011 12:50 pm
Andy

An Income Payments Agreement has only been around since 2004 and is an agreement bewteen the trustee and the bankrupt to be approved by both parties normally wthin a period of 14 days of the proposal. Once it is signed by both parties it becomes an Income Payments Order that is the only difference.

Kallis do you still fancy that pint, I have to agree with Andy as a volunteer on this website your are priceless its just that even after publishing an extract from the Insolvency manual to verify the information I gave Catherine you still felt a professional would come along to verify things. Anyway God Bless you all this is my final post it has been fun most of the time, from now I am a reader and not a poster
 
 

kallis3

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Post by kallis3 » Sun Apr 03, 2011 1:01 pm
Thank you The Major - I'd have a pint with you anytime!

Thank you for those kind words.

Please don't stop posting because of me.
Sharing from experiences of dealing with debt
The greatness of a man is not in how much wealth he acquires, but in his integrity and his ability to affect those around him positively.
Bob Marley.
http://kallis3.blogs.iva.co.uk
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