annual renewal report this week and its not good.

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rpw

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Post by rpw » Wed Mar 12, 2008 10:58 pm
We received the first annual renewal report this week and its not good.

Our IP - Gibson Booth - have increased their Supervisors fees from 5000.00 to 8151.00. This is an increace of 61% from the original cost stated at the creditors meeting. Nominees fees. disbursements and VAT will be added to this, which is likely to take the final total cost to over 13,000. As this is only the first annual review, this figure could increase because they are charging us for everything. Including any telephone calls we make to seek clarification on issues relating to the IVA. There are no specific details of their charges, apart from a vague general summary of costs. It really seems they have the power to create any figure they want!

Gibson Booth blame the increase on five points:

1. Extra time because the IVA had 19 modifications.
2. Sending a reminder to us for the RX1 form and confirmation that we were not in a personal pension scheme.
3. Dealing with our telephone enquiry about the annual review.
4. Extra work carrying out additional reviews of our income because of the modifications.
5. Extra time to chase creditors who did not provide the required evidence.

We have disputed all of these points and we have attached a copy of our letter on the next question as it would not fit on this page.

Furthermore, they have admitted to an error on the voting schedule, which did not contain details of our mortgage with the Halifax. This is detailed in the letter.

Also, we have received confidential correspondence for another of their clients. This is detailed in the letter.

To be honest - this stinks of incompetence and I would question the validity of the original IVA if the agreement we signed is not the correct agreement.

Do we have any grounds for persuing this? Is there an ombudsman who we could refer this to?

Any ideas?

letter:
RE GIBSON BOOTH CHARGES
The original Supervisors Fee agreed at the creditors meeting was £5000.00. This fee has now been increased to £8151.00. This is a massive increase of 61% from the original fee.

You have provided details of charges on your ‘Time and Chargeout Summaries’ sheet. However, we have no way of verifying the authenticity or accuracy of this information because there are no details of the actual work undertaken.

You have provided a brief written summary that identifies five reasons for the increase in fees, which we wish to query.

1. All modifications were known prior to the meeting of creditors. Therefore, any additional work required should have been identified and included in your original fees.
2. There were no timescales stipulated on your letter in respect of the RX! Form dated 8th March 2007. We did not receive any reminder in respect of the payments into a pension scheme.
3. We assume this relates to our telephone conversation where we requested clarification to enable us to complete the annual review. However, you will recollect that our confusion was caused because you failed to send us the correct documentation. You only sent us the ‘50% of Overtime/Bonus’ sheet and not the ‘50% Additional Income’ sheet.
4. This modification was known prior to the meeting of creditors. Again, any additional work required should have been identified and included in your original fees.
5. We have no control or influence over creditors failing to provide the required evidence. It is unfair that we are financially responsible for circumstances that are beyond our control.

We are extremely concerned with the error made by you in respect of the voting schedule for the initial creditors meeting. You have not clearly identified what this error is in your letter but we assume it is the omission of our mortgage providers, Halifax Building Society from the original documents? At no time did you advise us the Halifax would be included in this arrangement, had we known this we would not have accepted the arrangement. This is a serious issue as the IVA agreement that exists is not the agreement we signed. As this is a legal contract, what are the legal implications of this error?

We have received correspondence for another of your clients for whom you are managing an IVA. This is very worrying and creates questions about client confidentiality. What assurances can you provide that this is an isolated incident and our details have not been sent in error to other people?

We await your response in due course.
 
 

MelanieGiles

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Post by MelanieGiles » Wed Mar 12, 2008 11:16 pm
What is the basis of their remuneration as agreed by creditors at the creditors meeting? Time costs or fixed fees? If the former, you may struggle to prove that their fees are not justified, if the latter, they will need the resolution of creditors to take more than was originally agreed.

I would personally be amazed if they have a time costs resolution on an IVA that is just one year old.
Regards, Melanie Giles, Insolvency Practitioner
 
 

ianmillington

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Post by ianmillington » Wed Mar 12, 2008 11:53 pm
Wow! I can understand your annoyance.

Are you self employed, which might dictate the basis of time costs?

Ian
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PDHL Ltd (formerly Personal Debt Helpline Ltd)
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Reviva UK

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Post by Reviva UK » Thu Mar 13, 2008 12:15 am
Interested to follow this one too.

we recently had a client who wanted to put forward a full and final settlement offer with gibson booth and they refused to propose it unless we paid 500 for the cost to do it.

We have seen a few of their proposals and they all seem to be time / cost
Paul Johns
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Assisted Bankruptcy Specialists
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MelanieGiles

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Post by MelanieGiles » Thu Mar 13, 2008 12:26 am
Their website indicates that they are a well qualified bunch, but it does seem that their IVAs are similar to ones I was putting forward 20 years ago!
Regards, Melanie Giles, Insolvency Practitioner
 
 

Reviva UK

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Post by Reviva UK » Thu Mar 13, 2008 1:20 am
Melanie

surely you are not old enough to have been working 20 years ago !
Paul Johns
Reviva UK
Assisted Bankruptcy Specialists
www.revivauk.com
 
 

MelanieGiles

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Post by MelanieGiles » Thu Mar 13, 2008 7:41 am
Aha - very complimentary, but sadly true!
Regards, Melanie Giles, Insolvency Practitioner
 
 

rpw

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Post by rpw » Thu Mar 13, 2008 6:34 pm
I am not sure what the method of charging was. It quoted a figure in the original proposal of 5000.00. Surely the items they claim have taken more time should have been included in the original costs because the modifications were known before the proposal was agreed. Also, some of the items they claim have taken more time were due to their mistakes?
Any thoughts on the 'error' in the original proposal. Does this give us any opportunity to withdraw from the IVA?
Failing all that, do we have any right of appeal for any of this?
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