considering a full and final iva

26 posts Page 1 of 2
 
 

sarah_nick

User avatar
Posts: 9
Joined: Wed May 09, 2007 6:08 pm
Location: United Kingdom

Post by sarah_nick » Wed May 09, 2007 6:10 pm
Hi, my husband and I are are currently in IVA,s (2 years in)and are considering a full and final from a third party (Mum & Dad). We have joint liabilities through two of our creditors of which our IVA's currently offer a 27% dividend from each. As we are offering full and final could the dividend be changed to 13.5% for these creditors so that the final offer to them would be 27% over both arrangments.

Thank you for your help
Sarah and Nick
 
 

jamesfalla

User avatar
Posts: 206
Joined: Thu Jan 04, 2007 8:16 am
Location:

Post by jamesfalla » Wed May 09, 2007 6:53 pm
Sarah_Nick

Quite often creditors will accept a lump sum settlement in the middle of your IVA which pays less than the dividend originally offered. This is because, as old arguement goes - a bird in the hand.....

You should discuss the situation with your IP. Tell them that your parents may be willing to offer up a lump sum and find out what the IP thinks they will need to get an agreement.

James Falla

Expert in IVA, Bankruptcy and informal Debt Management solutions for over 10 years.

For more information visit www.jamesfalla.com and visit my blog at: http://jamesfalla.blogs.iva.co.uk
James Falla

Expert in IVA, Bankruptcy and informal Debt Management solutions for over 10 years.

For more information visit www.jamesfalla.com and visit my blog at: http://jamesfalla.blogs.iva.co.uk
 
 

Sadsack

User avatar
Posts: 635
Joined: Fri Aug 18, 2006 12:40 pm
Location:

Post by Sadsack » Wed May 09, 2007 8:03 pm
Sarah_Nick

I would most certainly jump at the chance of ending my IVA early. Having read some other threads on this forum, there seems to be some chance that creditors will accept a lump sum payment as long as they are getting something close to the original pence in the £.

As Jamesfella says, chat with your IP and I am sure there is a way out of this early.

Good luck and let us know how you get on.

Sue
Ho Hum! Think I'll bang my drum!

Read My Blog
http://sadsack.blogs.iva.co.uk/
 
 

allan.f

User avatar
Posts: 38
Joined: Sat Feb 03, 2007 7:07 pm
Location:

Post by allan.f » Wed May 09, 2007 8:31 pm
Hi,
Is there a danger that if a sum of cash was available to propose a full and final settlement the creditors would want the lump sum AND for the IVA to run its full term,after all it is their money.
 
 

Skippy

User avatar
Posts: 20720
Joined: Sat Oct 21, 2006 6:08 pm
Location: United Kingdom

Post by Skippy » Wed May 09, 2007 8:34 pm
You need to make it clear that it's a loan that will need to be repaid from your disposable income rather than a gift so that it won't be treated as a windfall.

Yesterday is history, tomorrow is a mystery, today is the present - a gift to make the most of.

View my blog at http://skippy13.blogs.iva.co.uk/
 
 

MelanieGiles

User avatar
Industry Expert
Posts: 47612
Joined: Tue Jan 09, 2007 10:42 am
Location:

Post by MelanieGiles » Wed May 09, 2007 10:37 pm
Are your IVA's completely separate, or are the mutual and interlocking. If the latter, which I suspect they are, then the joint creditors only get one lot of 27% - so you could say that is 13.5% each in any case. If the IVAs are separate, then the joint creditors must get a share from each estate, unless you can specifically modify something different within the variation proceedings.

Regards, Melanie Giles, Insolvency Practitioner for over 20 years.

For further details contact me at http://www.melaniegiles.com and view my IVA blog at: http://melaniegiles.blogs.iva.co.uk
Regards, Melanie Giles, Insolvency Practitioner
 
 

sarah_nick

User avatar
Posts: 9
Joined: Wed May 09, 2007 6:08 pm
Location: United Kingdom

Post by sarah_nick » Thu May 10, 2007 11:21 am
Hi thank you for your replies.

The IVA's are seperate, we pay our contributions seprately each month, but the original proposals were calculated on our joint incomes (I hope this makes sense).

We had a joint loan through Egg for £18,000 and our current account overdraft through Lloyds TSB, I think it was about 5,000. All of our other debts were in our own names. Therefore we were set to pay Egg & Lloyds 54 pence in the £ over both arrngements - 27% from each. (which I feel is unfair to the other creditors).

I did want to make a modification to our original offer through the lump sum F&F, so that all the creditors received the same 27%. - is this possible??? As you can imagine this would reduce the amount I would actually need to offer.

I feel its now or never with regards to offering, as I have just been given notice of redundancy and my employment ceases at the end of month. As I have two small children, I can only work three days a week around my Husband, as he works 12 hr shifts Friday, Saturday and Sunday. So there is no gurantee that I will be able to find another job straight away. I've checked with Child Tax credits and we would not be entitled to any extra money, as my husband earns to much. So I feel my monthly contributions are at risk as realistically my wages have been paying the contributions for the last 2 years.

My Husband pays £255.00 and I pay £295.00 a month into the IVA's. We have a joint debt of £50,000, but as we have joint liabilites through Egg & llyods my total debt is £39,000 and my Husband's is £36,000. - As you can see it makes a hell of a difference.

Can anyone please advise?? we have no assests as we don't own our own home, but would actually quite like to have one one day!!. Does anyone think this is resonable to offer 27% to all creditors when two of them were expecting to receive 54 - given our current situation??

Thanks for your help.

Sarah & Nick - PS the lump sum is coming from my parents and in the letter to the IP, they are going to make it clear that the funds are only availble if the Full and Final offer is accepted if it's declined the funds will be withdrawn.
 
 

Adam Davies

User avatar
Posts: 14596
Joined: Thu Mar 29, 2007 12:21 pm
Location:

Post by Adam Davies » Thu May 10, 2007 1:45 pm
Hi
Thats a strange one,two of your joint creditors both receiving a dividend from each of your IVAs,I wonder what would happen if you were proposing a 55p dividend each ??
Why your IP didn,t suggest your IVAs be proposed as interlocking and funded by one monthly payment I do not know,this way they would have received just the one dividend.
I think that due to your job situation a full and final offer is a sensible solution and you need to work with your IP on this one.
You are right in stating that the lump sum is a gift that will only be given if it is used to conclude both your IVAs
Good luck

Andy Davie
IVA.co.uk Spokesperson and site manager
(aka Neverending)

Please check out my blog: http://andydavie.blogs.iva.co.uk

View my profile here:
http://www.iva.co.uk/andy_davie_profile.asp
Andam Davies
 
 

MelanieGiles

User avatar
Industry Expert
Posts: 47612
Joined: Tue Jan 09, 2007 10:42 am
Location:

Post by MelanieGiles » Thu May 10, 2007 2:01 pm
Nothing strange about that Andy - just the very way IVA's were originally set up to work! I would always do separate IVA's if the minimum dividend was achievable in each estate.

I now understand the issue raised by the poster, and can see the point of your question. Your suggestion to split the dividend between the joint creditors now retrospectively will not work - unless you get their agreement at a variation meetin, and the view they are likely to take is "Why should we" if the other creditors are not being asked to accept a reduced dividend.

As you have to make a decision now, based upon a change of circumstances which is outside of your control, then I suggest you put an offer to the IP based upon what you could afford to raise. It is not unfair for the joint creditors to get two dividend cheques - this is the reason why many of the lenders do seek to lend money jointly - as they get the benefit of joint and several liability.

Sarah I think that you have every chance of success with all of your creditors accepting a reduced return - given the circumstances you describe. Good luck and let us know how you get on.

Regards, Melanie Giles, Insolvency Practitioner for over 20 years.

For further details contact me at http://www.melaniegiles.com and view my IVA blog at: http://melaniegiles.blogs.iva.co.uk
Regards, Melanie Giles, Insolvency Practitioner
 
 

Adam Davies

User avatar
Posts: 14596
Joined: Thu Mar 29, 2007 12:21 pm
Location:

Post by Adam Davies » Thu May 10, 2007 2:14 pm
Hi Melanie
What about my point regarding a 55p dividend on joint debts.Are you sayng that the creditor would receive a dividend totalling 110% of the debt ?

Andy Davie
IVA.co.uk Spokesperson and site manager
(aka Neverending)

Please check out my blog: http://andydavie.blogs.iva.co.uk

View my profile here:
http://www.iva.co.uk/andy_davie_profile.asp
Andam Davies
 
 

sarah_nick

User avatar
Posts: 9
Joined: Wed May 09, 2007 6:08 pm
Location: United Kingdom

Post by sarah_nick » Thu May 10, 2007 5:04 pm
Thanks for your replies.

I will ring the IP tommorrow to discuss a reasonable offer and let you know in due course how it went.

Thanks again.

Sarah
 
 

MelanieGiles

User avatar
Industry Expert
Posts: 47612
Joined: Tue Jan 09, 2007 10:42 am
Location:

Post by MelanieGiles » Thu May 10, 2007 7:04 pm
Sorry Andy - read the first sentence but not the second!!

No a dividend of 110p would not be payable, unless there was provision for statutory interest at which stage the joint creditors would receive extra monies.

Regards, Melanie Giles, Insolvency Practitioner for over 20 years.

For further details contact me at http://www.melaniegiles.com and view my IVA blog at: http://melaniegiles.blogs.iva.co.uk
Regards, Melanie Giles, Insolvency Practitioner
 
 

sarah_nick

User avatar
Posts: 9
Joined: Wed May 09, 2007 6:08 pm
Location: United Kingdom

Post by sarah_nick » Tue May 15, 2007 3:38 pm
Hi again,

URGENT - Just phoned the IP, they want the whole of the remending payments as F&F.

Let me explain about our IVA's

My IVA I owe £39,601.63 and pay 295.00 x 60 = 17,700 of which 27% was due to go to creditors = £10,692.33
leaving 7007.67 to the IP for fee's etc.

I have paid so far (including Mays payment) 25 x 295 + additional contributions of 616.29 = £7991.29

My Husbands IVA is owed £36,293.75 and pays £255 x60 = £15,300. again 27% to creditors = £9799.31 and £5500.69 to IP.

He has paid 25 X 255 and 2194.39 in additional contributions = 8,569.39


What do you belive is a suitable offer as my parents have only £10,000 spare??????- bearing in mind that two of our creditors are receiving two dividends.

PS - I have also enquired about the fee's and they said they will get back to me, as I have no idea why My Husband is paying just over £1506.98 less in fees that what I am.
 
 

Adam Davies

User avatar
Posts: 14596
Joined: Thu Mar 29, 2007 12:21 pm
Location:

Post by Adam Davies » Tue May 15, 2007 4:33 pm
Hi
20k to go to your creditors and 12.5k to your IP,how on earth can that be justified ??
You have paid in 16.5k so far,so if you offer 10k in full and final it will allow 6.5k to cover your IP fees,considering that you have three years left on both your IVAs then the saving on fees should be in the region of 6k.I would say that your offer of 10k is right on the button and why your IP states that they want the remainder of your payments as a full and final baffles me beyond belief.
Go back to them with a 10k full and final offer.
regards

Andy Davie
IVA.co.uk Spokesperson and site manager
(aka Neverending)

Please check out my blog: http://andydavie.blogs.iva.co.uk

View my profile here:
http://www.iva.co.uk/andy_davie_profile.asp
Andam Davies
 
 

chris_

User avatar
Posts: 100
Joined: Wed Apr 11, 2007 6:25 am
Location:

Post by chris_ » Tue May 15, 2007 4:57 pm
Andy,

I'm saying nothing !

Chris.
26 posts Page 1 of 2
Return to “the hot hot IVA topics in 2007, 20 replies plus”