Windfall or Bonus?

[Endsmeet]

Hi,
I am about to receive a performance related payment of approx £700 gross.
I do not have any 50% clause regarding overtime and I have a 'first £500 is mine' windfall clause, my I.P. has confirmed this for me.

Would this payment of £700 gross be actually classed as a windfall, it is performance related and has been earned over the past yr, not just given as a present/surprise etc.?

OK I do understand that after tax,N.I. etc that I will probably receive about £530 so at the most I would have to pay £30 but I would like to have a few opinions/suggestions before I get in touch with my I.P.
Thanks in advance

[ianmillington]

Check not only the proposal but the chairman's report as well. If there is no provision in the proposal I would normally expect it to be subject to a creditor modification.

Ian

[Endsmeet]

Hi Ian,
Now you've lost me[?][:I]
My I.P. has said on at least three occasions that any overtime that I work will be mine and that they won't be asking for any extra payment from me so I don't seem to have a 50% clause in my agreement, also the £500 clause is there as well but I would just like to know what my I.P. or yourself would class as a 'windfall'
If there is no provision, why should it be subject to a creditor modification?
Surely if its not there, it doent apply etc. etc.?

[ianmillington]

You will appreciate that I am trying to advise without sight of any paperwork and so what I will say is to a degree generic.

Your proposal sets out the basic terms. However, at the creditors meeting the creditors will have voted to accept your proposal. They may have included modifications that your IP had to put to you and ask you whether you accept or reject them. These will most likely be a condition of the acceptance vote. One of them is quite likely to cover what happens if there is a bonus, especially if it wasn't covered in the proposal. The modifications will be set out in the Chairmans Report to which I have referred.

So far as "windfall" is concerned, I would define that as something that in a bankruptcy would be described as after-acquired property. Classic example are inheritances, lottery wins etc. There is an element of something falling into your lap, which was not envisaged at the time you made your proposal. Given the performance-related element of your bonus, I am struggling to call that a "windfall".

I am mindful that it is income and might therefore be something that ought to be covered by the annual review if it's not dealt with elsewhere. If your IP has told you in unambiguous terms that he's not interested in the money then go with what he has told you. You might therefore be lucky.

Hope this helps

Ian

[Endsmeet]

Hi Ian,
Thanks for your reply,
Yeh, I'm sorry that I expected you to comment on something that you haven't really seen, its just that sometimes....well you know the rest.

When my IVA proposal was ok'd, there was only one modification that actually affected me. The chairman said that the other mods were to do with any increase in I.P. fees etc which was at their end and doesn't concern me.
The mod was to do with my company pension and that I was to either opt out or continue with the pension but pay an increase into my arrangement (which I agreed to), nothing else was mentioned concerning bonus payments etc.
No other mods were asked for my consideration.

I think the best thing is to wait until tomorrow when I will obtain my paysheet then I will know the actual net amount that I am to receive as payment and then get in touch with my I.P. and ask them as to what do they think.

Thanks for your advice and help, it is appreciated and I will post back with the 'result'

Thanks Again

[ianmillington]

I'll be honest and say that if you got away without a provision covering overtime, commission and bonuses then the creditors reps must have been having a bad day, and as a result you had a good one![:)]

Let us know what your IP says - I'll be interested to see how they approach it.

Ian

[Endsmeet]

Hi Ian,
Yeh will do...
Maybe the company pension mod gave the creditors something to discuss and they overlooked 'other' things.

Just had another glance over the chairmans report and there is defo nothing about 50% overtime payments (which my I.P. has confirmed when alot of overtime came my way a few months back) and there is only the 'first £500 is mine' clause which relates to any windfall.
Defo nothing about any performance related earnings or other.
I suppose it depends now on what my I.P. deems to be the difference between a 'windfall' and 'performance related earnings' payment.

Thanks again for your advice and quick reply.

Will post back as soon as I know.

[Endsmeet]

*** Update ***
Hi Ian,
Sorry for the delay in updating
Just got a reply from my I.P. and they said that the clause in my agreement says that any monies received over 500gbp net (apart from normal salary) should be declared and paid into my agreement.
As I received an actual amount of 518gbp, I should pay the +18gbp into the agreement as it is a payment out of the norm so to speak (windfall).
I have agreed to 'up' my next payment by the 18gbp one off payment then revert back to my regular payments.

I expected this really and at least I don't have the overtime 50% clause so at least I can still keep any overtime that I work.

Thanks again for your advice in this matter.

[chris.g]

Sounds like you've come out on top with this one Endsmeet. [:D][:D] Have fun spending the £500.....

[sblack]

That is great news, Enjoy!!

[emma_t]

Doessound good endsmeet.

I thought the overtime clause in my iva would be irrelevant to me as I can't do overtime with my job....but for the first time ever I was offered weekend work demonstrating the products I sell in the week in department stores. This was just after approval of my iva and half was duely handed over to IP, even losing half was worth it to me as I still had a bit extra to get me over Christmas.
You are lucky not to have this clause[:)]
Now you have £500 to do with what you please[:)]

[Endsmeet]

Hi All,
Yeh, its nice to have the 500gbp to spend but I have just transfered it all to my savings account for a rainy day, its something that I have learned since being in an IVA is not to waste money now but to keep hold of it no matter how tempting it is to buy something.
I don't really need a new telly or simi, so I now think to myself 'Why buy one?'
I used to have times which I call 'sod it moments' when I used to buy something because I fancied it and all that happened was that I got bored with it after 6months and was alot more in debt.

May just use it for a nice weekend break away, somewhere nice in the U.K. which I can drive to and just relax in some mountain cottage and forget about 'living' for a few days[:D].

Also as for the 50% overtime clause, I can't believe how lucky I am not to have this as even thou overtime is not a regular thing for me, the extra pennies really do help out when birthdays,xmas and the like come around.
Thanks for everyone here for your thoughts and congrats, they really are nice to receive especially when you feel....well you all know

[emma_t]

I had so many 'sod it' moments before my iva Endsmeet, but now I have made a rule not to impulse buy. I go away and think about it overnight and invariably I think about it and decide I don't need the item anyway.

Its a lot of 'sod it' moments that got me into a mess in the first place!!

Nice break away sounds like a perfect idea, have fun whatever you decide[:)]

[chris.g]

Weekend away sounds like a good plan.....

[Endsmeet]

I haven't had a break for a few yrs now and this will be the 1st time were I'm spending my money not a creditors and it will feel so nice[:)]

But I won't spend too much thou, nice little log cabin somewhere miles away from civilisation ....God I'm becoming a scrooge (or Bear Grylls) and again, it feels very good[;)]